Follow up questions for yesterday’s comments on “sex, babies and procreation in heaven”: Does the Bible say Adam and Eve engaged in sexual love? I don’t believe there will be sexual love because it would diminish our love for God, right? How could there be more people born heaven when Christ paid the price for ALL the world and that part of history is completed (in eternity)?
First, the question yesterday is here. Let’s go through today’s questions that came in response to yesterday’s answer. Does the Bible say Adam and Eve engaged in sexual love?
The first specific mention of sexual love in Scripture is AFTER the fall of man into sin:
Genesis 4:1 Now Adam knew Eve his wife, and she conceived and bore Cain, and said, “I have acquired a man from the Lord.” (NKJV)
That no children or sexual love is specifically mentioned before this reference, does not necessarily mean that it did not occur. That is reading something into the verse that simply isn’t there. There COULD have been sexual love.
What’s more, I have looked and looked, and admit I might be missing it, but I don’t read anything conclusive in Scripture that declares there were no children before Cain. If you know of a verse that teaches this, please send it to me.
Further, Cain is scared someone will kill him once God banished him for killing Abel (Gen 4:14). Where did those other people come from? Obviously from Adam and Eve. Were those children conceived after Cain, and yet had time to go out and build and populate entire other communities?
We assume Cain was firstborn because no other children are mentioned previously in the Bible. Does that mean there were none? Or was there a period of time before sin that Adam and Eve were fufilling God’s command to “be fruitful and multiply”?
Of course those speculations still hinge on whether or not there is a definitive verse that states Cain was the firstborn of all human children. I can’t find one, but trust someone will enlighten me if there is.
Now, one substantial argument would be all sin came through and because of Adam and Eve’s sin, so there must not have been other humans before sin occurred. Would it not stand to reason that if there WERE sinless children before the Fall of man, they would then be infected by the curse of sin when their parents fell? Not an illogical question. Speculative, DEFINITELY, but hardly inappropriate or fanciful.
So you are left with the following possible scenarios, and again, this is all just studious speculation, thinking about how life MIGHT be in heaven, so if you can give me Bible verses that clearly refute any of this, PLEASE DO. I would be very appreciative. Here’s the possible options of Eden:
- Adam and Eve sinned very shortly after being created
- Adam and Eve lived a good while in perfection with God before sinning, but had no sexual love
- Adam and Eve lived a good while in perfection with God before sinning, and had sexual contact that did not result in children
- Adam and Eve lived a good while in perfection with God before sinning, and had children who were not under the curse until they sinned
My own personal intuition is, and that’s ALL it is, is number three is most likely though the last option is intriguing. They lived for a period of time in perfection and fellowship with God, enjoying all aspects of their relationship including sexual love, but not long enough to have children (or perhaps God delayed them having children).
My point? We make FAR TOO MANY assumptions without thinking them through, or realizing that the Bible simply does not, often, support our common assumptions.
The Bible does not say Adam and Eve didn’t enjoy sexual union before sin, and given God’s commandments, and the obvious relationship-building aspect of sex, it doesn’t even seem consistent.
Even if Adam and Eve were only alive a FEW DAYS before sinning, it doesn’t seem likely they would have ignored the obvious sexual attraction, nor does it seem likely God “turned sex on” only after sin occurred. Just doesn’t make sense, and is not consistent with anything about “why?” God created us male and female, and gave us our physical attraction. Sexual attraction is NOT BECAUSE OF the sin curse, it is part of our created essence. God made us that way. Sin didn’t cause it.
In fact, I would propose that sexual attraction and activity WERE present before sin simply because of the feelings of shame that came after sin. What did they cover up in shame? Their sexual anatomy. That should tell us something. Another reason I think this is because immediately following the creation of woman, God declared that she would become “one flesh” with her man, a clear reference to sexual consummation.
Now, why am I talking about all this? Because the question is on the table about sexual love and procreation in heaven. WHAT OCCURRED WITH PERFECT CREATION BEFORE SIN, WOULD REASONABLY BE A CLEAR INDICATION OF WHAT WILL OCCUR WHEN THAT PERFECTION IS RENEWED AND RESTORED.
The answer about “sex and procreation in heaven” is always “of course not!” because 1) habit, 2) there is no marriage in heaven, and 3) we will be like the angels. We discussed the “marriage” thing yesterday so see that answer.
I’m just pointing out that all I am able to find from Bible teaching, answers and commentary is ASSUMPTIONS that there will be no sexual love or procreation in heaven BUT, given the model of the Garden of Eden, God’s command to procreate and fill the earth BEFORE the fall of man, and the fact that there is simply NO Scripture that prohibits the possibility…. we should quit automatically saying the answer is “no” (to sexual love and procreation in heaven) when the Bible doesn’t say that.
The answer might be “no” but it could be “yes” too.
At this point in my own study of it, I can’t find “no” in the Bible, or “yes” but there seems to be more INDICATION of “yes” than “no”. You don’t build doctrine around “indications”, but neither do you build it around “assumptions”.
Next, I don’t believe there will be sexual love because it would diminish our love for God, right?
My comment is the usual: there is no Scripture that teaches that. I would ask this: did it diminish Adam and Eve’s love for God?
God pronounced His Creation “good” (perfect) and commanded Adam and Even procreate and fill the earth with offspring, obviously involving sexual love. Would God’s creation be perfect if obeying His command lessens His creation’s love for Him? Or was it not that way for them, but will be that way for us? Maybe, but again, why? What’s the reason? Why the difference? And what Scripture even hints at that?
It all goes back to our foundational ASSUMPTION: “no sex or procreation in heaven” based on no Scripture. That assumption makes us interpret a whole lot Scripture and questions negatively when the Bible simply states no such negative (that I’ve been able to find).
To the contrary, even in eternal perfection, our relationships will honor God and glorify Him, not diminish our love for Him or distract us from Him.
Question: if sexual relationships would diminish our love for God, why wouldn’t friendships, mates, family or ANY type of relationship other than our one with God likewise diminish our love for Him? Will we have NO relationships in heaven lest they diminish our love for God? Or does that only apply to sexual love? The logical extent of this idea is that we would have NO relationships with other people or angels in heaven. Not likely or logical.
Finally, How could there be more people born heaven when Christ paid the price for ALL the world and that part of history is completed (in eternity)?
If Adam and Eve had not sinned, they would have filled the earth with their offspring who would have no need for salvation because they hadn’t sinned or been born with sin as we are.
In heaven, IF there is procreation, and we resume (there’s one of those words again: resume, restore, redeem, return, replenish, etc) filling the New Earth in the same manner as Adam and Eve would have filled the original Earth, then those children will not be born with sin, and won’t need to be saved in the sense that we understand it.
Folks, this is all speculation and good old fashioned dreaming of what heaven will be like. We’re not building doctrine, stating doctrine or declaring black and whites. However, let’s please quit making the same old assumptions about heaven that do MUCH damage to the reality of what we are going to enjoy and experience.
Heaven is NOT a never-ending church service of ghosts surrounding God’s throne singing hymns in the clouds. Heaven is NOT mystical, otherworldly and unimaginable. Yes, we cannot fathom the DEPTHS and WONDERS of everything about heaven, but God HAS given us plenty of references.
As I said in a previous answer, if you can imagine people, then you can imagine people in heaven, MINUS SIN. If you can imagine the heavens (stars, space) and the earth, then you can imagine the NEW heavens and earth, perfectly recreated without sin or corruption. If you can imagine beauty, adventure, work, love, joy, relationships… then you can imagine all those things, ONLY PERFECT, with no sin, no pain, no tears, no disappointment.
God has given us plenty of clues and reference points by which to imagine what heaven will be like: a perfect earth, with perfect people, living and working in perfect love and fellowship, walking and talking in perfect relationship with God, enjoying everything God always meant for humans to enjoy in a perfect creation.
If you find anything blatantly wrong, and have Scripture to prove it, I insist you take the time to let me know. I do not want to even SPECULATE about something the Bible has clearly answered.